TomaMoto 2008-06-05 20:18:26

Statistically speaking, something has to be up for quite a while in order for it's score to ultimately reflect its standing among newgrounds viewers. That being said, what's all this "Being on the Top 50 used to mean something?" It still does mean something. It means you're popular at the moment. Sure, some things have been in the Top 50 for a very long time but if there's one point I'd like to make, it's this:

NEWGROUNDS IS A FLASH PORTAL, NOT A MUSEUM OF FINE FUCKING ART.

It is ever-changing. It is not some static memorial to those great flash authors of yore. Newgrounds is still comprised of the many people with whom you disagree. There are massive social gaps between different segments of the community that are not easily bridged. You may try all you want to understand and explain what happens within the portal, but changing things is difficult.

Now I genuinely do appreciate your concern for the community and the portal, KupaMan. I wish you the best of luck in making newgrounds more like your ideal. A real man will strive to change what he thinks is wrong or unjust, and without getting too fucking preachy, I'll say that I hope you go about this like a man. Just let me remind that you've chosen a tough beast with which to tangle.

Gerkinman 2008-06-05 20:43:51

I remember back in the day when getting a 3.50 was considered a good score, now its not even enough to get you daily 10th.

Im of the mind that the system needs a drastic reform, whether it be that voting levels should be judged by the number and ratings of your own submissions rather then how many reviews that say "lol funny" you write. Or some kind of paid account on the website that turns reviewing into a priveledge, along with deleting reviews off your own submissions and the like. But then again people would exploit that just as much as they do the current system. I know i wouldnt mind forking out money for some extra priveledges tho.

Tho i have to disagree with TomaMotos statement about things always changing, while that may be true, according to his logic Citizen Kain is no longer a fantastic movie just because more movies have come and gone. And that fact that Waterlollies and Apples are the only movies on there that got to where they are on there own merrits (Tankmen wouldnt be as big without NGs name behind it) makes it all the more depressing.

Its a sad state if affairs to be sure but in the end its up to the viewers, more unfortunate is that every year the viewers IQs seem to drop a level and are ever more easily amused. And aslong as this trend continues things will only ever get worse for anyone trying to be succesfull on there own merits.

Aznime 2008-06-05 20:51:12

This is one of the same problems that needs to be fixed on the Audio Portal. Newgrounds should have some sort of system to require a number of votes to see who REALLY should have the top score.

squeakytoad 2008-06-05 20:56:51

"lol! i totally agree with this movee! 5!!!"
"dude, no. 0"
"hahaha! i laughed once! 5!!!"
"gonna 0 this because its lame"

Anyway, you and I must learn to adopt an "oh well" attitude toward this. It's not changing any time soon.
It's just like YouTube now: Scores don't matter.

Also, WHEN ARE YOU GONNA MAKE A NEW MOVIE MAN. I miss your flashes. :'(

WordOfHate 2008-06-05 20:58:26

KupaMan i agree with you wholeheartedly the society of newgrounds is spiraling downwards to a dark place. People are becoming Simpletins and i too agree with TomaMoto its not a museum but alot of the Top 50 shouldn't be there. Their are many many much more deserving submissions on newgrounds deserving the Top 50.

People don't look for creativity anymore. Its laughs and Dumb idiotic stuff that appeal to the masses now. I feared it but i think the movie Idiocracy was more like a movie telling of things to come. People are dumbing down and not really giving any thought to anything anymore. If it makes them laugh then its automatically a 5/10.

Its really sad to think that the youth of the WORLD are so simple anymore. I may be a hypocrite, if you look at my favorites you'd see alot of stupid stuff in there, but I've seen so many wonderful pieces of art are out on the portal. Art isn't anything anymore. A flash can be utterly horrible looking, but have some kind of humor and people will look past the art and focus on the joke. Art used to be a way to express ourselves but not its just becoming a way for people to tell lame cheesy jokes.

I mean if you look at some of the people out there in the world today its sad. The internet was once a profound place where dreams could come true and it was always so amazing, Now you cant google something without getting some kind of pornography. It's sad and ridiculous. If you think about it, places like America used to be places of intellectual culture and profound places.

But the youth of today and tomorrow are epicly failing us all. I know kids who are my age(yeah im a kid 14 btw) but anyways i know kids my age and older who dont know right from left. People are becoming so lazy and dumb that they don't acknowledge what they have to take in and astound others with. If you were to test the average IQ of America it would be low.

Many people are taking places and things like the Internet for granted. The internet used to be a place of knowledge where people all over the world could share things of reason and importance. Now its just a place where you can make a quick buck having sex. It's utterly disgusting.

Even places like Newgrounds, once utopias of art and creativity are spriling into hell.

So i submit to you KupaMan, Maybe us the few, the proud, surviving people stop honestly appreciating the flashes submitted on Newgrounds. And ourselves stop submitting them. Then when this once great place finally spirals into chaos we can swoop back to save it and maybe other places will start doing this as well. A rebirth of "The Great Awakening" where the masses start to appreciate what art was and is. And not some pieces of crap that takes no time what so ever so that the person submitting it can get their 5 minuets of fame. We could give the people who deserve it their days maybe even weeks or months of fame and they can ear honest respect and not some cheep appreciation from a bunch of brain dead populous.

Sincerely a true believer
"WoH" WordofHate

FrozenFire 2008-06-05 22:46:47

I understand and agree completely. The voting system has a 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

Yet People only see 0 and 5

Dazmi 2008-06-05 23:04:49

The best of all time is a matter of opinion, but the list up there is the Flash Movies that have been voted the highest.

I know the best movies to you are all the old movies you remember, but no one is watching those anymore.

xthesnarfx 2008-06-05 23:23:53

I do remember the days I would go to the top 50 and always see my favorites. i.e. Dark Angel (I forgete if that's it's real name) Dad's Home, and much much more. But you also gotta take video game parodies always get higher scores. I don't know why but they do.

ExtraChewy 2008-06-05 23:33:47

remember when the best movies would have a score of 4.24. Now there's 599 movies over that. And there's not one score of 4.24. That shows how people just vote 5's.

JonBro 2008-06-05 23:34:46

1. More Brawl Taunts
Pretty funny. It will drop from #1 pretty soon, of course.

2. Epsilon
It's really professional, and although simple, it's really an interesting game. It reminds me of Portal.

3. Apples.
Heh, definitely a unique and funny little video. I like how incredibly cartoony this movie is.

4. Deep Sexy Space
I haven't watched this and I don't plan to.

5. Sonic Shorts Volume 3
There were one or two parts that I thought were really funny, but overall it wasn't that amazing. It will drop from the top very soon.

6. The Last Stand 2
Well-done game that has very detailed graphics. I'd say it deserves its spot in the Top 10... for now, at least.

7. Tankmen Infinity
This was amazing. It was funny, well-animated, and it fit perfectly with the original Tankmen series. I think it should stay in the Top 50 for a long time.

8. Waterlollies
Needless to say, this was incredibly well-animated and drawn. The story is creative (although a bit bizarre) and it doesn't get boring. It should stay where it is.

9. Metal Gear Awesome 2
I don't see why there's so many people dissing this movie. It may be overrated in a sense, but that doesn't mean it isn't still well-animated and hilarious. It should at least stay in the Top 50.

10. TANKMEN 2
Great humor, great animation, strange but still fun concept. I don't see what's wrong with this being an all-time top scorer.

Balvuc 2008-06-05 23:47:46

Okay, get two points.

A list of classics, which may only contain flashes of X months old, sorted by score normally.

Or get the voting power to be reduced based on how early this vote is being submitted in comparison with the date the flash has been submitted.

Since new flashes tend to get high scores nowadays, this should work positively.

I am sorry, my brain's already sleeping. I might be writing nonsense.

MRat 2008-06-05 23:56:13

I vote reforms be made.

Anything that isn't 100% original, this means, artwork, characters, sound music, should be ineligible to win any money.

I'm tired of seeing authors get handed cash for doing nothing but scribble and yell into a microphone. I'm not saying they don't have their place on the site, but honestly, cash?

I exclude theme specific days like Pico Day and Madness Day of course.

But music should be entirely new, or taken from the audio portal. The story can't be in anyway based of something previously done without the permission of the original author. No using characters that somebody created without their permission. If you can get the legal rights to some copyrighted music, then I suppose thats fine.

People are getting way too much credit for things they haven't even done.

Rooster 2008-06-06 00:21:55

waterlollies and Tankmen 2 are the only ones from that list that should be on there.

PiGPEN 2008-06-06 00:38:36

I remember when the XiaoXiao animations would not budge from the top spots FOR YEARS.
So given a choice between a stick animation on top for years and a wave of crap each week i'd rather.....get rid of the fucking thing.
The point system should be rendered obsolete after daily and weekly awards are doled out.

LoveSlater 2008-06-06 00:46:19

I know you have been in Newgrounds for a long time... longer than i've ever had but even though you've been here for a long time it feels as if you're out of touch with the inner workings of this place. NG has grown exponentially over the years and the large influx of new users has far surpassed the quantity of trained, educated voters of the good old days. Hence, that explains the nonsensical all time top scoring movies + garbage reviews/votes. And it is not gonna change.

It's always sad to see a guy like you, an experienced user and long time flash submitter , whining but not because of the current "sad state of the NG nation" but rather because you are becoming obsolete, NG changed and you stayed the same. Sorry , but the hard truth has to be said. NG never was and definitely by now will never be an artistic website. It is all about entertainment. You will never get those dozens of useful technical reviews that you crave so much, sorry sir it won't happen. Your standards and expectations are far too high for what NG's user base is capable of offering. Stop being so delusional. The game has changed. If you don't change too , you will be left behind in the cold dusty winds of time.

The typical NG user now doesn't give a flaming rat about how long you took to make that flash, how you have challenged yourself technically to create that lighting/ transition effect or how you worked so hard to make the most serious/artistic/transcending flash piece of this website. No, they don't care. Not even a bit. They can't tell a tween from a frame-by-frame animation. All they care about is to be ENTERTAINED. They want to LAUGH or see something COOL and if you're not doing that - you're no good to them and they will vote accordingly.

It is what it is buddy, you're right now at the crossroads where every experienced animator stands.

"Should I leave NG and cherish those sweet memories of those good old days while they're still fresh in my mind or should I stay here, doing what i love to do and yet putting up with the indifference and ignorance of these voters ?"

I've seen too many good animators leaving and not coming back when they got to this crossroad and didn't saw a reason to be here anymore - perhaps you're at that point or you're close to it. Whatever your choice be , God bless you.

Incognitus 2008-06-06 02:30:47

Of course the weekly top submissions make the Top 50! Then they slither down and off the list, save for the very popular ones. This has always been, right?

However, there is a problem with many users voting either 5 or 0, and it's on the rise. I blame the majority of younger users. Just look at the average review on any submission. I guarantee bad spelling/grammar and ignorant/irrelevant commentary. Not to mention either a rating of 10 or 0. I sometimes forget there are still adults or mature kids posting on Newgrounds.

The YouTube generation is here...

MRat 2008-06-06 02:36:53

LoveSlater, you just came across as a huge jackass. Nothing you said revealed any sort of truth, and you acted like some crusader of justice, telling KupaMan where he went wrong.

Why do you assume he doesn't know the things you mentioned? He was very civil about what he said, and he wasn't wrong. He never said anything to indicate that the reason wasn't what you said, so why jump in like you're infinitely more aware than he is?

Please, for the sake of everyone around you, stop being self-righteous.

stankbug 2008-06-06 02:53:37

its alot like the audio portal. the top 50 changes almost daily there i find it obnoxious with all the 5's or all the 0's. theres horrid yes and great yes but not as much as people seem to see anymore. the main difference is the lack of zero bombers in the flash portal. im which im glad there arent as well. akthough as they may seem as a solution to the problem. even with that though as soon as it hits the from its flooded with 5's. the community has changed from actually judging things to saying "OMFG TAHT RAWKS!!!!11" now. i think the portal needs to mature a little and actually judge what they see not the title or the authors.

jtm17 2008-06-06 02:55:01

KUPAMAN
Simple Formula
Score/Time
The Longer The Flash Has Been on The Site And The The Higher Score The Better The Flash.....
More Brawl Taunts Has Only Been on For Only a Week Or 2...
Not LIke MGA2 or Waterlollies....
I also Think That Any One Who is upset that their flash has been up there for AGES Can They Just Be Happy?
Like Tomamoto said
NEWGROUNDS IS A FLASH PORTAL, NOT A MUSEUM OF FINE FUCKING ART.
I Dont Mind Shitty Animation...But we do need MOAR Quality Submmisons.
However i have NO IDEA how we could change the System Of Voting...
RANT/OPINION LOLZ

Cheers

Hoeloe 2008-06-06 03:13:19

I know what you mean. I joined Newgrounds back when Final Fantasy A+ was top scoring. That stayed there for about a year till it was replaced by Littlefoot. What we really need are more people who understand the Newgrounds community. You see, this is being caused by a lot of new users watching submissions on the front page and fiving because they were on the front page, not really if they liked them or not, then leaving reviews akin to "LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!111one11!!!". This of course means that front page submissions will recieve a huge number of five votes each week. Once a submission is taken off front page, it only recieves fair votes, and this pushes it off the top of the all time list and the new front page submissions are back up there.